Minutes of the April, 2003 Herald's Meeting

Click here for a Printer Friendly (Black and White) version
Minutes Page
Main Herald's Web Page


*****NEWS***NEWS***NEWS***NEWS***NEWS***NEWS***NEWS***NEWS***NEWS***NEWS*****
The Heralds’ Pavilion will have new banners at upcoming events, thanks to
Jehanne de Wodeford and Marguerite du Royon.

*****JOKE OF THE MONTH*** JOKE OF THE MONTH *** JOKE OF THE MONTH *****
You know the world has turned upside down when the best rapper is a white guy, the best golfer is a black guy, the French think the Americans are arrogant, and the Germans don’t want to go to war!!!
*************

MINUTES OF THE MONTHLY MEETING – 9 April 13 xxxvii (2003)

The meeting was held on Sunday, 13 April 2003, at the home of Eilis O’Boirne. The meeting started at 12:15 pm and ended at 3:10 pm. In attendance at this meeting were: Gaius M.L. Auklandus, Vesper; Berengaria de Montfort de Carcassone, Sable Swan; Marguerite du Royon, Seawolf Herald; Astrið of Swansvale, Latimer; Frederick of Holland, Brachet; Teleri Tawel, Pursuivant for Crosston; Felix MacAvady, Pursuivant for Ste. Katherine, Anastacia Grindstead of RavenOak, Acting Glora Fjord Pursuivant; Maxen ap Morgan, Pursuivant at Large; Wilhelm von Homburg, Neassa ingen Gilla Chriost mhic Cathasiagh , Geoffrey le Dragon, Catherine de Gray, and Antonio Giordano da Sicilia, PEs at Large; Elsa Saxisdottir, Edith de Laufare and Emma FitzWilliam, cornets; Sabina le Sewester and Niya, visitors; and Eilis O’Boirne, Matins.

COLLEGE OF HERALDS MEETINGS
The upcoming meetings are: May 18, June 1, July 20, September 7, October 19, and November 16. Meetings are generally held at the home of Eilis O’Boirne, 2322 Russell Street, Berkeley, CA 94705. Call for directions. Meetings start at noon. There is no meeting scheduled for August or December 2003.

Anyone who is bringing a walk-in submission should contact Matins in advance. This is especially important if the submitter has previous submissions, since the files are stored in a remote location. If you are bringing a submission to a meeting, please plan to arrive by 11:00 am to allow the file to be set up.

We are researching some of the name submissions beforehand through an email list, names@synergy.transbay.net. This list is open by request to heralds in the West Kingdom who are interested in onomastic (name) research. To join the list, please contact Felix MacAvady at ha.raschid@sinewave.com.

Since there was no interest expressed in voice instruction at the monthly meetings, it is being discontinued as a regular feature. If interest is expressed in the future, it will probably be offered again.

ANNOUNCEMENTS
HERALDS’ COLLEGIUM: The Fall Heralds’ Collegium is scheduled for November 15, the day before the November meeting – it will focus on book heraldry and the mechanics of running a court. It will probably be held in the Mists. If you know of any appropriate sites, please contact Baldric Pursuivant, Letitia de Scotia.

SUBMISSION REQUIREMENTS: Until the end of June, submission fees are $8 per name, $8 per device, $8 per badge – and a name and device registered at the same time will cost $15 instead of $16. There is no fee for resubmission of a returned item. Submissions require 3 copies of the name form and documentation, 4 colored copies of the device form, and 3 colored copies of the badge form, as applicable. The submission forms for the West Kingdom College are now available from Matins or the Kingdom consultation table or by following the http://heralds.westkingdom.org/Register.htm#Forms. Completed forms should be sent to Matins at the College address.

MAILING LIST: The West Kingdom College of Heralds has a mailing list for internal communication. Any herald is welcome to join by request. To join the list, please contact Felix MacAvady at ha.raschid@sinewave.com.

ELECTRONIC RESOURCES: Many interesting heraldic links can be found through the SCA Heraldry web page at www.sca.org/heraldry, including the Laurel home page, the on-line Armorial and Ordinary (with search capabilities) and The Academy of St. Gabriel (an onomastic and heraldic consultation service). The West Kingdom Heraldry site and the West Kingdom Awards List can be accessed through the West Kingdom site, www.westkingdom.org. Heraldic queries may also be addressed to Eilis at heralds@westkingdom.org -- answers may take a few days.

BRACHET MEETINGS
These meetings comment on heraldic submissions from other Kingdoms. Please consider attending – you do not have to be able to attend every week. They are a fast way to learn how the Rules of Submission work and how to research armory. The Brachet meetings are in Berkeley on Wednesday nights. If you are interested, contact the Brachet Herald, Frederick of Holland (Fred Hollander) at 510-653-3652.

Cynaguan commenting meetings are starting up in Golden Rivers at the home of Antonio Giordano da Sicilia. The schedule is the 2nd and 4th Mondays of each month, 6:30 - 9:30 pm.  (1024 42nd Street; house is at the intersection of 42nd and J Streets; third house from the SW corner -- on the west side of the street). For additional information, contact the Sable Swan Herald.

HERALDIC PUBLICATIONS
West Kingdom College of Heralds Minutes are published on the web. They may be read at or printed from the heralds’ website at http://heralds.westkingdom.org/Minutes.htm. There is a colored version and a printer-friendly black and white version available.

The latest edition of the Armorial and Ordinary, along with updates for the previous editions, are available from Free Trumpet Press West along with other useful heraldic publications. Write for a free price list. The address is Free Trumpet Press West, 1613 N. School St. Normal, IL 61761-1240.

A Pictorial Dictionary of Heraldry as Used in the Society for Creative Anachronism (by Bruce Draconarius of Mistholme and Akagawa Yoshio) is available by sending $15 to Bruce Miller, 1711 Tenth Street, Manhattan Beach, CA 90266, (310) 379-1321.

EXCERPTS FROM THE LOAR
The LoAR for January has been published. The cover letters, acceptances and returns for the past can be found at http://www.sca.org/heraldry/loar/. If you are interested in responding to some of the calls for commentary put out by Lord Laurel, please be sure to visit the site.

The acceptances for the West from the Laurel January meeting were as follows:

Beryl of the Valley of the Moon. Device reblazon. Vert, a bend argent and overall a winged lion rampant to sinister sable fimbriated argent, wings erect argent fimbriated sable.

The previous blazon, Vert, on a bend argent a winged lion rampant to sinister sable fimbriated argent, wings erect argent fimbriated sable, placed the winged lion entirely on the bend.

Raven of Drachenheim. Name and device. Sable, a Latin cross crosslet and on a chief argent a fleur-de-lys between two ravens regardant respectant sable.

Rosario de la Torre. Name and device. Argent, a tower and in chief two roses sable.
Note: Rosario is her legal given name.

There were no Western returns in January!!!

In Service,

Eilis
Matins Herald


SUBMISSONS – 13 April xxxvii (2003)

ITEMS SENT TO LAUREL

Aileth Gardiner     (Southern Shores)      Name Registered 07/02, New Device

Per pale azure and Or, a chevron between three bees counterchanged.

Aminah al-Zarqua’     (Selveirgard)      New Name and Device

Argent, a rose azure barbed and seeded proper, on a chief azure, a salmon naiant embowed argent.
The names are taken from Arabic Naming Practices and Period Names List (www.s-gabriel.org/names/daud/arabic-naming/ by Daud ibn Auda). She will not accept major changes.

Céline di Moneta Angeli     (Crosston)      New Name and Device

Sable, four swords in cross conjoined at the pomel argent.
Céline is in Withycombe at Selina, as the name of a 5th-C French saint. Moneta is a nickname for Giacomoni (de Felice p.42); di is the patronymic connective. The submittor sends substantial documentation in the form of Names from Arezzo, Italy, 1386-1528 (www.ellipsis.cx/~liana/names/arezzo.html by Aryanhwy merch Catmael) documenting the name pattern with a double surname – one of the examples supports Angeli in this position. This was submitted with de instead of di – we believe di to be correct. We do not see a problem with combining a French given name with Italian surnames. The sound of the name is most important to her.

We feel that this is clear of the badge of Balthazar Thornguard: Sable, a sword inverted argent, the blade enflamed proper. This should be the old-style enflaming outlining the entire blade (which would now be blazoned “the blade on a flame proper”), and should be worth a difference in this case. The other difference would be for the number of swords.

Dietrich Lorenz Uhl     (Saint David)      New Name, see Returns for Device
The names are all documented from Brechenmacher. Dietrich is dated to 1487 on p.312 v.I. Lorenz is dated to 1486 on p.206 v.II. Uhl is on p.712 v.II. It is dated to 1253 as a surname and as a short form of Uhlrich.

Indirabai At-tar     (Golden Rivers)      New Name and Device

Vert, an elephant statant and on a chief embattled Or, a feather fesswise vert.

The name is Indian. The Book of Indian Names by Raja Ram Mehotra is the source of the following information, none of which is dated: p.7 At-tar is a Kashmiri family name based on the Persian or Urdu equivalent of the traditional occupation of herbalist cum scent dealer. p.110 Indira is one of the personal names attached to the goddess Lakshmi. p.67 –bai is a female suffix attached to the given name among the Parsis. The submittor wishes an authentic name for India. She will accept Indira At-tar as an alternate.

Isabelle Françoise de Sancerre     (Esfenn)      New Name and Device

Vert, a unicorn’s head erased within an annulet of acorns inverted, slipped and leaved, argent.
Isabelle is on p.267 of Dauzat as the name of a sister of Saint Louis. Françoise is found (Madame Françoise de Soilli) in An Index to the Given Names in the 1292 Census of Paris (http://www.sca.org/heraldry/laurel/names/paris.html#F by Colm Dubh). Sancerre is found in French Names from Two Thirteenth Century Chronicles: Place Names Used in Locative Surnames (http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/arval/crusades/crusadesLieux.html by Arval Benicoeur). She will not accept major changes, and the sound of the name is most important.

Johanna Ludwiger von Hertesbergk     (Esfenn)      New Name and Device

Azure, three bears passant argent.
Socin p.26 gives Johanna dated 1094, 1185 and 1192. Brechenmacher p.214 gives Ludwiger as a patronymic dated to 1363. Hertesbergk is one of the period spellings of the name of the town in Germany now known as Herzberg – this form is found at www.museum-schloss-herzberg.de as dated to 1360. Click on Schlossgeschichte, then on Ursprung, then on Play twice for a list of the various forms the name has taken. She submitted, and would prefer, Ludwiga as the second name, but we were not able to document it.

Mór Dhána     (Vakkerfjell)      Name Registered 03/01, New Device

Ermine, on a lozenge azure, a lacy knot Or.

Sabina le Sewester     (Champclair)      Name Registered 01/02, New Device

Party of six gules and argent, three spiders inverted argent.

ITEMS RETURNED FOR FURTHER WORK
Aithne Raven of Oakwood     (Cloondara)      New Name and Device Returned

Argent, a pall inverted vert between two ravens and a tree eradicated sable.
According to the submittor, Aithne means fire in Irish Gaelic and the Raven and Oakwood elements have “personal meaning”. She did not submit any documentation. She will not accept changes, and the meaning is most important to her.

We could not discover Aithne in any of our valid Irish name sources, with any meaning at all. The modern Scottish Gaelic word (not name) aithne means "knowledge, discernment, acquaintance", and we doubt it's meaning is significantly different in modern Irish Gaelic or period Gaelic. We do find lots of Celtic Baby Name web sites claiming Aithne is Celtic or Gaelic and means "fire", but then they're not exactly trustworthy sources. There is a similar Gaelic name, Eithne, that was in use in Ireland in the 8th-11th centuries (http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/mari/AnnalsIndex/Feminine/Eithne.shtml). If meaning really is most important to her, then she may be interested in the early period Aednat, which really is a feminine form of Gaelic Aedán, and so does etymologically derive from a word meaning "fire".

In addition, there are problems with mixing languages (Gaelic and English) and possibly temporal disparity with combining either of these given names with the English Raven and Oakwood, since we have no evidence of Irish and English being mixed in the same name. The submittor will be advised of Irish surnames based on Bran (raven) and Darragh (oak).

The device appears free of problems, but cannot be submitted without a registerable name. It should probably be redrawn to make the pall inverted wider and the charges more distinct.

Dietrich Lorenz Uhl     (Saint David)      New Name Forwarded to Laurel, New Device Returned

Quarterly Or and sable, an owl gules marked sable between four crosses clechy counterchanged.
The device is being returned for re-coloring. The drawing is good overall, but the owl is not actually colored gules. It is a sort of orangy-brick, and the sable markings on the wings are so substantial that the overall effect is of an owl proper. If an owl proper is what he wants, he may be able to have it; if he wants an owl gules, that is what he should submit. This is between the two and is not acceptable.

Ronan Archer     (Vakkerfjell)      New Name Returned
This submittor did not include the $8 registration fee, and we were not able to contact him before the meeting.

Both names are from McLysaght – Ronan is on p.179 and Archer is on p.20. Rónán (note accents) is on p.157 of O’Corrain & Maguire as a popular name in early Ireland – there are ten saints of this name. McLysaght states that the Anglo-Norman name Archer came to Ireland in the 13th century.

William Gunbodo     (Battle Rock)      New Name, Device Resubmission to Kingdom Returned

Argent, a double headed eagle sable, a chief embattled and in base a (mound? base wavy?) azure.
This is the submittor from March who did not submit a name (William Bryant Robertson). He has not submitted a different device, and the one he submitted last month has a line on the base section that is not really a mound and is not really wavy – it is closest to being “negatively double-enarched”, which doesn’t exist. We are consulting with him on the device.

The submitted name is documented from a website: Germanic Names in the Lowlands before 1150, www.keesn.nL/names/name2_en.htm and www.keesn.nL/names/name7_en.htm. While we could use the information on that site to support a possible construction of Gundbodo, and while the site supports the given name Wilhelm, “Wilhelm Gundbodo” does NOT mean “willful protector/leader – battle commander” and is not an appropriate given name/byname construction. In addition, the submittor wants a name appropriate to a landesknecht, which would require a substantially later name form and construction. We will consult with him on his name and what he really feels is important to him.


Minutes Page
Main Herald's Web Page