Minutes of the September, 2001 Herald's Meeting

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Minutes -September, AS XXXVI (2001)
The meeting was held on Sunday, Sept. 9, 2001, at the home of Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn. The meeting started at 12:00 and ended at 2:00 p.m. In attendance at this meeting were Astrið of Swansvale, Latimer; Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn (this month's artist), Harpy; Felix MacAvady, St. Katherines; Owen ap Morgan; Gwenhwyfaer ferch Gwilym, Baldric; Eilis O'Boirne, Banner; Walraven van Nijmegen, Nebuly; Berengaria de Montfort de Carcassone, Deputy Sable Swan; Maxen ap Morgan; Anahita bint'abd al-Karim al-Fassi; Frederick of Holland, Brachet; Teleri Tawel, Matins.


The upcoming meetings are: Oct 7, Nov. 4, Dec. 2, Jan. 6, 2002, Feb. 3, Mar. 10, Apr. 14, May 12, June 9. These regular meetings will be held at the home of Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn, Harpy Herald. (address removed from webpage) Contact her if you need directions.

The Oct. meeting will be a Road Show near Vacaville. Contact Christian de Holacombe for details. March 9-10 will be a Herald's Collegium with the regular meeting on Sunday. Frederick and Eilis will not be available for the October date. In view of the light submissions, the College is considering meeting every two months instead of every month. Discussion on this suggestion is welcome on our e-mail list, wkheralds@transbay.net. The WKHeralds list is open by request to heralds in the West Kingdom. To join the list, please contact Matins.

ANYONE WITH WALK-IN SUBMISSIONS SHOULD CONTACT MATINS IN ADVANCE. This is especially important if the submitter has previous submissions, so I can make sure to bring the file.
Currently we are researching names beforehand through an email list, names@synergy.transbay.net. The Names list is open by request to heralds in the West Kingdom who are interested in research. To join teh list, please contact Matins.

Please send all correspondence (submissions, minutes, subscriptions, etc.) to the address at the top of this letter! Please do NOT send submissions or minutes requests to Vesper.


NEW SUBMISSION FORMS -- The Laurel Sovereign of Arms has issued a standard set of submission forms for use by all kingdoms. Laurel has stated that these forms will be required for all submissions to the College of Arms. This requirement begain in February, 2999. Therefore, unless there is an unexpected change in this policy, we are forced to return any submissions not using the new forms henceforth. The new forms are now available from Matins or the Kingdom consultation table. We are still receiving submissions on old forms.


Subscriptions that expire in September: none. Subscriptions that expire in November: none.

There was discussion about moving the Minutes to the Heralds portion of the West Kingdom web site to make them available to a wider audience. Our current subscription list is down to 10 people which might be considered uneconomic. However, such a move will not be practical until Matins gets a scanner, as there is no other way to publish the emblazons.


These meetings comment on heraldic submissions from other Kingdoms. Please consider attending. They are a fast way to learn how the Rules of Submission work and how to research armory. The Brachet meetings are in Berkeley on Wednesday nights. If you are interested, contact the Brachet Herald, Frederick of Holland (Fred Hollander).


Subscriptions to these minutes are available for $15 for one year from the College of Heralds at the address in the letterhead. Updates to the Armorial and Ordinary are available from Free Trumpet Press West along with other useful heraldic publications. Write for a free price list. The address is Free Trumpet Press West, 1613 N. School St., Normal, IL 61761-1240.

A Pictorial Dictionary of Heraldry as Used in the Society for Creative Anachronism (by Bruce Draconarius of Mistholme and Akagawa Yoshio) is available in the United States by sending $15 to Bruce Miller, 1711 Tenth Street, Manhatten Beach, CA 90266, (310) 379-1321.


Many interesting heraldic links can be found through the SCA Heraldry web page at http://www.sca.org/heraldry, including West Kingdom submission forms, the Laurel home page, on-line armorial and ordinary search and The Acadamy of St. Gabriel (a heraldic consultation service) which is now back on line after a temporary hiatus.

CURRENT FEES & Requirements

There has been a request for the Minutes to include current submission requirements. Current submission fees are $10 per name, $10 per device, $10 per badge. There is no fee for resubmission. Submissions requires 3 copies of the name form and documentation, 4 coloured copies of the device form, and 3 coloured copies of the badge form, as applicable.


Excerpts from the Letter of Acceptances and Returns, dated 5 August 2001, from Dame Elspeth Anne Roth, Laurel Queen of Arms.

Farewells and Thanks

At Pennsic we will be formally investing Master Francois la Flamme as the new Laurel King of Arms (currently scheduled for Great Court). His duties as Laurel, however, have already started and Mari Elspeth nic Bryan and Zenobia Naphtali will be ruling on the August submissions the weekend before the investiture.

Konrad Athalwolf. Name
     Submitted on the LoI as Konrad Adelwolf, we have changed the name back to the originally submitted form.

Liadan ingen Glassain. Device. Argent, a triquetra within a bordure embattled purpure.

Richenza d'Assisi. Name and device. Per pale argent and vert, a grape leaf inverted within an orle counterchanged.
     The name was documented as having a Polish given name with an Italian byname, but no evidence was provided that Poland and Italy were in sufficient cultural contact that the combination is registerable. However, the given name seems not to be limited to Poland: for instance, it was borne by the daughter of Henry the Fat, Duke of Saxony, who later married Lothar II, Holy Roman Emporer. The contact between Germany and Italy was sufficent to allow registration.
     The primary charge was blazoned as an oak leaf, but the emblazon showed a grape leaf.

Catterina da Calabria. Device. Azure, six leaves argent.
     Nice armory!

Dionisia de Boys. Name and device. Barry sable and argent, on a pile azure a mullet argent.

Ecorngill, Shire of. Branch name change from Encinal, Shire of.
     Their former name is released.

Gaius Marcellus Liberius Auklandus. Name change from Cai de Lyon.
     The submitter had originally registered Gaius Marcellus Libris Auklandis in August 1979. It is unclear whether he intended to release this when he registered Cai de Lyon in December 1989; we are giving him the benefit of the doubt and registering this submission under the Grandfather Clause.
     His former name is retained as an alternate name.

Rhiannon of Sevenoaks. Name and device. Per chevron azure semy of acorns and Or, in base a fox sejant guardant gules.
     Rhiannon is SCA compatible.

Sabrina Truelove. Name and device. Purpure, a dolphin hauriant embowed Or, a base wavy barry wavy argent and vert.
     Please instruct the submitter to make the divisions on the base of equal width.

Sanchia de Illora. Device. Per bend argent and sable, three roses proper and three bees Or.
     The original blazon was corrected in a timely manner.

Tangwystl verch Morgant Glasvryn. Device change. Vert, a chevron between three falcons argent.
     The submitter has permission to conflict with Caitly Emrys, Vert, a chevron between three peacocks pavonated to base argent, and Harrys Rob of Wamphray, Vert, a chevron between three winged spurs argent. Her former device, Per chevron argent and vert, in base a falcon close argent, is retained as a badge.
     Nice armory!

Venera di Nardiello. Name and device. Azure three escallops inverted within a bordure argent.

William MacNaught. Reblazon of device. Argent, a chevron between three crosses crosslet fitchy each sustained by a hand fesswize azure.

Wulfric of Creigull. Device change. Vert, on a pale between two Latin crosses argent a Latin cross vert.
     His former device, Vert, on a pale engrailed between two Latin crosses argent, a Latin cross vert, is released.

Saint Crispin, College of. Device. Per bend azure and argent, a seahorse naiant argent and an open book gules within a laurel wreath vert.
     The presence of the seahorse makes the seahorse, book and laurel wreath all part of the primary charge group, thus violating the rule of thumb in RfS VIII.1.a, Tincture and Charge Limit, limiting a single group to no more than two types of charges.


In Service,

Teleri Tawel
Matins Pursuivant

1. Cassandra of Crosston     [Crosston]     New Name

- Will NOT acept major changes.
- Gender: female
Interested in 12th-13th centuries.

<Cassandra> Withycombe, p. 59 cites "The Trojan War was a favorite theme of medieval poets ... we thus find <Cassandra> a common Christian name in the 13th and 14th C. ... first recorded about 1207."

Please note that this is not a holding name; the submitter has chosen this name form.
See RETURNS for device.
Administrative note: Fees provided. Matins will make sufficient copies of the forms.

2. Duncan Jullings     [Crosston]      New Name & Device
Azure a bend sinister erminois between two serpents nowed Or.

- Cares about sound
- Gender: male
- Authentic for: Scottish, any date
Alternate: Duncan Julyan

Documentation done at Pennsic:
<Duncan> Withycombe, p. 90, header Duncan, cites Duncan II, 1094-95. as a given name in early 16th century Aberdeen (and so Lowlanders) from the ACR:
duncan tail3our 1507
duncan craik 1507
duncan portar 1512
duncan colisone 1521

<Jullings> Reany & Wilson, p. 258, header Julian. Jullings is an additional header spelling, no date given.
<Julyan> Bardsley, p. 437, under Julian, dated 1273

Administrative note: Fees included in Pennsic check. Sufficient copies of forms provided.

3. Ginevra da Ravenna     Resubmission of Device to Kingdom
Barry wavy gules and argent, a pegasus salient to sinister, wings elevated and addorsed, sable.

The submitter has obtained permission to conflict from Ioseph of Locksley who has registered as Rafael Blackriser (Oct. 76): Vert, a pegasus rampant to sinister, wings addorsed, sable fimbriated argent.

Administrative note: Name registered per Dec. 2000 LoAR. This device returned per Minutes Feb. 2000 for mentioned conflict.

4. Heafoc atte Ree     [Moroedd Oer]      New Name

Submitted as Hafoc Rhea. We could not find sufficient justification for the spellings of either given or surnames.
- Alternates: (1) Heafoc atte Ree
(2) Havoc atte Ree
(3) James Rea (mundane legal name)
- Cares about sound
- Desired meaning: Hawk (warrior) by the water
- Desired lang/culture: Middle English, pre 14th century
- Gender: male
Authentic: Middle or Old English language/culture

<Ree> In a second email correspondence, Harpy notes: "R&W (under <Rea>) list a variety of examples ... The closest in spelling uses <Rea> in <William atte Rea> 1327, with earlier examples tending towards <Ree> as in <William atte Ree> 1285. It derives from a word meaning 'stream, water'."
<Heafoc> Printout of email correspondence between Khevron Oktavii and Harpy Herald included, in which Harpy says: "As Reany & Wilson's examples show (under "Hawk") the earliest citations of this name come from the late 11th and early 12th centuries as <Hauoc> (i.e., <Havoc>), although the "standard" Old English spelling for the root word is <havoc> (also, as noted in Tengvik <Heafoc>) ... But the Old English spelling <Hafoc> ... would be extremely unlikely after the 11th century ..."
<James> Withycombe, mid 13th c. R&@, <Emma James> 1187.

See RETURNS for device.
Administrative note: Insufficient fees included. More than sufficient forms included.

5. Hermineite la Cochonne     [Champclair]     New Name

- Will NOT accept major changes
- Meaning: "pig" in French

<Hermineite> Catledge, Scott. Index to 1292 Census of Paris, 1996 Symposium Proceedings
<Cochonne> Dauzet Noms et Prenoms p. 138. 1389 Dijon. Morlet, Etude d'Anthropony mie Picarde p. 384, as in "Johanne Lae Cochonne" 1422.

See RETURNS for Device.

6. Mari Alexander     [Canale]      Change of Name & Device
Azure estencelly, in canton a four petalled rose Or.

- Currently registered name: Mari Greensleeves
- Will NOT accept major changes
- Will NOT accept minor changes
Gender: don't care

<Mari> Mundane first name. Copy of drivers license included.
<Alexander> Sept of the Scottish clan MacDonald. Printout included from www.aboutyourscottishname.com/donald_clan.html. The documentation establishes the antiquity of the clan as a whole but gives no specific dates as to the formation of individual septs.

Sharon L. Krossa: And wouldn't be any use if it did -- the issue isn't septs (which is a 19th century idea with regard to Scottis clans, anyway ;-), it is what forms/spellings were used in bynames in period.
Black, s.n. ALEXANDER, says "William Alexander was connected with the accounts of the city of Edinburgh in 1435 ... Robert Alexander was a granger in Feichly and Drummelochy in Strathdon in 1438. So <Alexander> in that spelling appears to have been in use as a byname at least in the 15th century. Since <Mari> is her mundane name.
ACR = The manuscript of Aberdeen Council Registers, Volumes 7-20 (1487-1551), in the Aberdeen City Archives, Scotland.
Black = Black, George F., _Surnames of Scotland_. Edinburgh: Birlinn, 1993.

Administrative note: Fee for name provided. Sufficient forms provided. Last device submission returned per Feb. 2000 Minutes. Current name registered Sep. 92. Current device registered May, A.S. XXI.

7. Maegwine Scipelie     [Champclair]      New Name
- Gender: female

<Maegwine> Searle. Onomasticon, p. 345.
<Scipelie> Ekwall, under header "Shipley", spelling documented from Doomsday Book.

8. Riocard mac Ronain     [Champclair]      New Name
- Cares about lang/culture: Irish, circa 1350.
- Gender: male
- Authentic for Irish, circa 1350.

<Riocard> OCorrain & Maguire, p. 155
<Ronan> OCorrain & Maguire, p. 157. Ronain is genetive form.

Administrative note: Fees provided.

9. Rognvaldr Gunnulfsson     [Cloondara]      New Name
- Typographical note: there is a hook attached to the base of the <o> in the given name.
- Will NOT accept major changes
- Cares about sound
- Gender: male

Documentation done at Pennsic:
<Rognvaldr> Lind, "Norsk-Islandska Dopnamn", col 861, header form, dated to 1312
>Gunnulfsson> _Sveriges medeltida personnamn_, vol. 8, (S.n. GUNNOLF) cites "Ion BUnnulfsson" to 1467.

Administrative note: Fee provided in Pennsic check. Sufficient forms provided.

10. Sabina le Sewester     [Champclair]      New Name
- Meaning: stitchery, sewing, embroidery in English
- Authentic for 12th-14th c. Eng. time period, lang/culture

<Sabina> Reany & Wilson, p. 182, under heading "Galliard" - Sabina Geyhard, 12956.
<Sewester> R&W, p. 418, under heading "Souster", Margery le Sewester, 1326.

Administrative Note: Fees provided.


1. Cassandra of Crosston     [Crosston]      Device
Argent a saltire sable overall a dragon in annulo wings folded to center azure.

Administrative note: Fees provided.
It was felt that the actual position of the dragon was unblazonable. The elements would pass if the dragon were in annulo with the wings in a normal position. Dragon with cramps.

4. Heafoc atte Ree     [Moroedd Oer]      Device
Azure, two hawks close respectant and a double-bitted axe inverted its haft extended to chief all within a bordure dovetailed argent.

Administrative note: Insufficient fees included. More than sufficent forms included.
We could not agree on the relative importance of the charges. Nor could we determine how to blazon the birds' raised feet.

5. Hermineite la Cochonne     [Champclair]      Device
Purpure a winged pig segreant argent between three mullets Or.

Device will be returned for redrawing as the current emblazon appears to be a tailless baby pig.

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